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Music

Anyways - Tom Petty wrote a boatload of memorable/catchy songs. That is a gift, IMO

The issue of popular acclaim does not define a good artist so I agree with your take on that issue, Rome.
 
"Memorable" often = simple and played on the radio a lot. There are any number of dumb songs that would be popular with greater exposure.
 
@rome8180 I can understand where you are coming from WRT Petty. His songs are frequently simple and really spare. I think that's the beauty of some of his songs. Is Billy Joel a better songwriter? Sure. Quincy Jones made Michael Jackson the king of pop. But Rock and Roll doesn't have a purity test, man! As Billy Joel famously wrote, "Hot funk, cool punk, even if it's old junk
It's still rock and roll to me"
 
rome8180 said:
I'll be honest. Don't get the appeal of Tom Petty. Admittedly I am not much into pop art in general. But his shit is just basic. And spare me the "it was popular so it must be good" arguments. Same with the "he was really good at working within a limited form." Way more impressed with popular musicians who manage to do something unique within that form. Quincy Jones is a genius. Tom Petty was not.
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Thought I was the only one. I liked a couple of his songs, but yeah, most are too basic/bland for me.
 
I'm giving Tom Petty a listen on Play Music right now, and Runnin Down A Dream is laughably simple. But it works. And like most rock bands, all of them can play better than I could ever dream of.
 
(I believe Billy Joel is garbage and essentially a musical con artist, but that's an issue for another time.)

Anyway, dinging Tom Petty for not being a great singer or musician is fair. But his songwriting is untouchable, imo. I know people hear Free Fallin and hear just three chords and assume anyone could've done that. But they couldn't. Petty was spectacularly gifted in this area, and a simple palette of colors just happened to be most comfortable for him.
 
rhfarmer said:
I'm giving Tom Petty a listen on Play Music right now, and Runnin Down A Dream is laughably simple. But it works. And like most rock bands, all of them can play better than I could ever dream of.
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See, I don't know what "it works" is supposed to mean in this context. Of course, going verse-chorus-verse over 1-4-5 "works" (though that's a hugely subjective statement anyway). If by it working, you mean it sold well and it gets in your head, then yeah. But I would argue that music operates by supply side economics and there were any number of songs released that same year that were just as catchy but didn't get the exposure.

I don't hate his music, ftr. There are many things out there that are far worse. I just don't think you can call him brilliant, even in the context of pop. He doesn't compare favorably to other recently dead musicians like Bowie, for example.
 
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rome8180 said:
rhfarmer said:
I'm giving Tom Petty a listen on Play Music right now, and Runnin Down A Dream is laughably simple. But it works. And like most rock bands, all of them can play better than I could ever dream of.
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See, I don't know what "it works" is supposed to mean in this context. Of course, going versus-chorus-verse over 1-4-5 "works" (though that's a hugely subjective statement anyway). If by it working, you mean it sold well and it gets in your head, then yeah. But I would argue that music operates by supply side economics and there were any number of songs released that same year that were just as catchy but didn't get the exposure.

I don't hate his music, ftr. There are many things out there that are far worse. I just don't think you can call him brilliant, even in the context of pop. He doesn't compare favorably to other recently dead musicians like Bowie, for example.
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I wouldn't describe him as brilliant either. I think Petty was really good a creating a mood with his music, plus he had his own, definitive sound. I'm not sure what else a rock star is supposed to do.

Also, I really enjoyed his lyrics. He made rhymes with words that didn't actually rhyme, which I think is fun.

And FTR, @TS9 I hate Billy Joel. But he composed good songs.

Rock and Roll is a lot like surfing to me. Everyone can pretty much agree on what's great and what's awful, but everything in the middle is subjective.

I do not, nor have I ever owned any Tom Petty. However, I like his craft as a songwriter and a lyricist.
 
The reason I brought up Billy Joel was not that I think everyone should like him. The point is we're talking about pop music here, regardless of what kind of rock veneer it might have. In that context, I think it's valid and at least somewhat objective to assess how much a songwriter understands the (admittedly limited) pop forms and plays with, complicates, or subverts them in subtle ways. Joel's songs show real compositional intelligence in that regard. So do others I've mentioned (largely at random).

Joel also happens to be much more divisive than Petty, which is why he popped into mind. I wanted someone who wasn't widely respected (Bowie) or that people feel largely neutral about.
 
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I was taking your post about Joel exactly that way. Wrote great pop compositions, I just don't happen to care for his sound.
 
On another note, got my girlfriend the 200-gram, four-disc vinyl of Pet Sounds. Easier birthday present than trying to find her clothing she will like and which will fit. Plus, I get to enjoy it too.
 
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Rome/Skins/Farmer/whoever else - what is a good new band/artist you've been listening to?

I've been listening to some high school era tracks, like this one:



Nice bouncy bassline for all you musician types.
 
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