Duke Men's Basketball 2013-2014 Discussion Thread

[DukeNukem05]

I think it's still fair to comment that we played more individual offense than team offense. Like rome, I don't think that is to blame for our struggles, but it was an interesting aspect to observe.

Defensive improvement is the Semi to next season.

 

[bdotling]

You are much more attentive to the numbers than I, so I can't dispute what you're saying. And I do recall seeing a lot of easy buckets from guys not being covered. But I maintain that the offense didn't look good at critical times. That said, we agree that we had a coaching problem this year. And that's not something I would have expected to say. So does anyone have theories as to the source of the problem? I've always thought our coaching staff was top notch and am somewhat at a loss.

You are right the offense didn't look good at critical times, but our defense was even worse at critical times, Klahn ran the numbers of the first 30 vs last 10 minutes of each game and the disparity in efficiency on both ends is pretty staggering. But that being said the fact our offense was that good for the first 30 minutes speaks to how amazing it really was especially if it was maintained for a full 40 minutes

 

[JustAFan]

I wish the coaching staff could/would respond. Anyone know how to make that happen without them feel like they're being beaten up?

 

[Topher]

Wojo stops by here pretty often so I'm sure he'll comment when he can

 

[JustAFan]

That's a class answer on Thorton's part and I would expect no less, but I'm not convinced it's that simple. And if Wojo does read this, please know that I'm coming from a place of interest and that's it. Love to know how the staff would sum up the season, some of the key losses, and the way the season ended. Thanks!

 

[DukeCrow]

That's a class answer on Thorton's part and I would expect no less, but I'm not convinced it's that simple.

That's his sig. Not Thornton responding to your question ;)

Seems to me the offense only looks bad at key times because the defense is sooooo horrible at those same key times. If your opponent just scored on 6 straight possessions to end the game and you only scored on 3 or 4, it might make fans perceive the offense to be stagnating relative to the opponent -- when it's actually the defense that was horrible.

 

[rhfarmer]

I'm not sure I want to be around when Wojo reads this thread...no offense justafan, but if you have been following Duke since the 80's, you'll know what I mean when I tell you to expect Wojo to vigorously defend K and the coaching staff...

 

[JustAFan]

No doubt. But I will gladly suffer the wrath in exchange for a thoughtful response to the notion that we had less of a the team approach and more of an individual making plays on the offensive side of the ball and how the staff thinks that, if it in fact existed, impacted results, whether he would argue that the real issue was primarily on the defensive side of the ball, and if, and come on - we lost games we should have won - there were things in terms of prep and strategy that didn't put the players in the best position to succeed.

 

[rome8180]

That's a class answer on Thorton's part and I would expect no less, but I'm not convinced it's that simple.

That's his sig. Not Thornton responding to your question ;)

Seems to me the offense only looks bad at key times because the defense is sooooo horrible at those same key times. If your opponent just scored on 6 straight possessions to end the game and you only scored on 3 or 4, it might make fans perceive the offense to be stagnating relative to the opponent -- when it's actually the defense that was horrible.

I think this explains it. Scoring at 1.2 ppp is a losing proposition when your opponent is scoring at 1.39 or whatever the averages are in the last 10 minutes.

 

[SeanMayTriedToEatMe]

Good offense should theoretically help the defense and vice versa. If the defense gets a turnover or simply forces a miss and rebounds, the offense gets a transition possession at best or a possession against a non-set defense at least. If the offense scores, the defense has more time to get set. That's just another thing that makes the offense/defense split so disgusting. The defense is probably even worse than the numbers say.

 

[MrAntHux]

Dawkins will participate in the college three point contest.

 

[ZackM]

Dawkins will participate in the college three point contest.

A win would be incredibly bittersweet.

Mostly bitter.

 

[DukeCrow]

So, basically, our defense sucked at the end of games because the team (or maybe just Jabari) was too tired and stopped talking.
http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...cles/the-hurdle-for-jabari-parkers-nba-career

The problem was when he was on the floor for prolonged stretches. He got four breaks per game, averaging two minutes each. He played 10 continuous minutes of game action just nine times in the final 10 games, which is less than two per game. Many star players have one stretch that long each half.

Normally, those prolonged stretches came at the end of games, as Duke looked to preserve leads or mount comebacks. There were several high-profile losses, including Clemson, Wake, and Mercer where Duke blew late leads and saw opponents go on game-clinching runs.

 

[DrKlahn]

Maybe this only interests me, but Duke spent about 5 minutes behind double digits all season. That's pretty crazy for a team that lost 9 games.

 

[rome8180]

Yeah, I was thinking about that yesterday. Our biggest loss was, what, 13 points? I guess our offense was so good that it always kept us in games.

It's crazy how thin a line there is between being a totally dominant team and one that disappoints relative to expectations and program standards.

 

[StopThePumpFakesShav]

Maybe this only interests me, but Duke spent about 5 minutes behind double digits all season. That's pretty crazy for a team that lost 9 games.

All of them were probably with like 2 minutes or less when our collapses were complete, I imagine? I'm thinking they were the final minutes of the Clemson, Wake, and Kansas games. Perhaps for a few seconds in the Mercer game too (lol).

 

[deeyoukayeee]

Maybe this only interests me, but Duke spent about 5 minutes behind double digits all season. That's pretty crazy for a team that lost 9 games.

Yep. This was the first year in a while we didn't get run out of the gym at least once since when, 2008? That was the weirdest thing to me. This team 'showed up' every single game, and almost always played well for 35 minutes. It is strange that a group can consistently maintain overall focus on periodic endeavors for four months but consistently lose focus within those endeavors upon 80% completion. A very unique form of ADHD/OCD took hold of this group.

I'm optimistic that this was a three standard deviation confluence of events - no post player, black Mormon superstar, rule changes and squirrel sightings - and can't possibly repeat itself next year.

 

[DrKlahn]

Maybe this only interests me, but Duke spent about 5 minutes behind double digits all season. That's pretty crazy for a team that lost 9 games.

All of them were probably with like 2 minutes or less when our collapses were complete, I imagine? I'm thinking they were the final minutes of the Clemson, Wake, and Kansas games. Perhaps for a few seconds in the Mercer game too (lol).

Your sense is correct. Let me get a little more mind-blowing.

I tried to count the number of offensive possessions outside of the final five minutes of the game in which Duke was down by 7+.

That number is:

Spoiler

21.

Alabama-3, Arizona-1, Clemson-1, Pitt-1, @Syracuse-1, Syracuse-3 @Wake-3, UVA ACC Championship-8

I like 7 because it is 3 possessions, so it is the smallest lead that really feels significant in a game psychology sense. But at the same time, everyone falls behind 7 points in a game from time to time, right?

I'm not totally sure that number is crazy by itself--I mean, Wichita State's number is probably lower--but it's insane for a team that lost 9 games.

 

[StopThePumpFakesShav]

And almost all of those (certainly UVA, Alabama, Pitt and probably Wake) were likely in the first 5-6 minutes or so, when you get the randomness of the first few possessions where teams may jump out to 9-2 or 11-4 leads and then quickly come back down to earth for most of the rest of the game.*

*Until the Duke Collapse is complete at least.

 

[DrKlahn]

Yeah, pretty much everything else was early in the game, or right at the 5 minute mark. It's kind of amazing to go through a season where you never fall behind big in a game. At least not at this level--Wichita State's situation is different.